Yess ask them to dinner!!, and other The Untamed feelings

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I finally found the time to write about my "The Untamed" finale feelings! I finished watching it the day I came home from my vacation, then left for D&D immediately after, and since then I've been busy writing about Worldcon. But! I still have feelings!

Mostly about Jiang Cheng, who is my favorite character. The reveal about the golden core – aaah I should have known! At first I suspected that's what Wei Wuxian was planning to do, but the fake-out with "Baoshan Sanren" totally fooled me. (I'm just a little sad that means we didn't actually get to meet Baoshan Sanren.) So everything that Jiang Cheng achieved, the sect he rebuilt etc., he'll forever question if he could have done it on his own without the golden core Wei Wuxian gave him. Without asking! And I always thought that Jiang Cheng had just been stupid trying to go back to Lotus Cove after it was destroyed and being captured, but no, he got captured because he played distraction, to save Wei Wuxian – the one time he sacrificed himself for his brother, and then his stupid brother comes after him and makes an even bigger sacrifice. And sacrificing his life Jiang Cheng could have dealt with, but having to keep on living, but without a golden core, i.e. everything his life has been about so far?, of course he couldn't deal.
His brother comes back after sixteen years, and instead of coming home or even contacting Jiang Cheng, he has a new BFF in Lan Zhan for some strange reason, who Jiang Cheng does not get along with; of course Jiang Cheng is jealous. I loooved Jiang Cheng and Wei Wuxian's conversation in the temple. So much angst. After Jiang Cheng got a great entrance and fight scene, that was very nice.
And in the end, when Wei Wuxian&friends leave and and Jin Ling asks Jiang Cheng why he let them and Jiang Cheng asks "what should I have done, invited them for dinner?" – YES, that is exactly what you should have done!
At least the possibility that one day they'll reconcile is still there.

I'm glad that DD watched with me and could explain a few things, like what Jin Guangyao was originally looking for in the temple (his mother's remains.) And also how the temple confrontation went in the novel ^^ I think I do prefer the drama version though, less crack. I didn't mind the pacing either, when there wasn't action there were still very tense conversations and reveals. It was a bit odd that the final dramatic conversations/confrontations were as much/more between Jin Guangyao and Lan Xichen than between Wei Wuxian and Lan Zhan, but I did enjoy them, and Wei Wuxian and Lan Zhan got their happy ending. Poor Lan Xichen though :( Not only did he put his trust in the wrong person, but Nie Huaisang made him kill Jin Guangyao. I was prepared to cheer for Nie Huaisang for his well-executed revenge, but that was a dick move.

Speaking of Nie Huaisang! frith_in_thorns called it; I was still hoping the secret player would turn out to be Wen Qing, though that was more hope than anything else. It makes a lot of sense: if Nie Huaisang wasn't a lot smarter than he appears, he never would be able to be the Nie sect leader, no matter whose brother he is. I wonder how many of his sect are aware?, the others must be so embarrassed. Also, when I went back to watch the first episode I saw him immediately, well done ^^

I'm a bit unhappy that Meng Yao and Su Zhe are both evil, i.e. the two clan leaders who don't come from a noble background, and they're not wrong in saying that the nobles have a lot of privileges they're not even aware of. The only not-noble not-evil character is Wei Wuxian himself, but even though his parents weren't noble, he was adopted by Jiang Fengmian as a kid. (Maybe Wen Qing and Wen Ning kinda count, they are from a noble clan but only a branch house.) At least, despite everything Yao did, I think the biggest asshole was still Jin Guangshan.

The leadership of Lanling Jin is going to be interesting after this: their last two sect leaders died in very ignominious ways (Jin Guangyao had Jin Guangshan killed by having him literally fucked to death, wtf), Jin Guangyao eliminated pretty much all other competitors, and Jin Ling is the heir apparent but is way too young and immature.

Wen Ning and Lan Sizhui going wandering together is adorable :) I'm so glad that Wei Wuxian finally found out that Lan Sizhui is Wen Yuan, why the fuck didn't you tell him Lan Zhan, poor guy was mourning. Lan Zhan does not have people skills. And he's Chief Cultivator now… I'm not entirely sure what this entails, but it's going to be interesting.

To sum up, I enjoyed this show a lot :) Very pretty, many feelings.
I mostly want canon-divergence AUs for this fandom, and post-canon fic. So many possibilities…

Comments

[ehyde]

You're the second person I've seen now who was hoping for Wen Qing to be the secret player, my sister also watched the drama having not read the book and that was her theory/hope too

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Wen Ning wasn't as dead as Lanling Jin claimed he was, why not Wen Qing? They might have kept Wen Ning alive because of his strength, but they might have kept her alive because of her skills as a healer and to control him... Wen Qing was never really a manipulator type, but maybe she adapted? Yeah, it was never a strong theory, but I really wanted her to be alive.
(She still could be! Taken somewhere Nie Huaisang didn't know about, a prisoner still or hiding far away and not hearing about recent developments...)

[ehyde]

I'm reading a fic where she's alive! It's good, not far along though and not happy yet. https://archiveofourown.org/works/20069548/chapters/47531338

[dancing_serpent]

And in the end, when Wei Wuxian&friends leave and and Jin Ling asks Jiang Cheng why he let them and Jiang Cheng asks "what should I have done, invited them for dinner?" – YES, that is exactly what you should have done!a

Now that I've finally watched all of The Untamed, I agree so much with this, and I really hope someone wrote that fic.

[schneefink]

I hope so too! I haven't really checked out much fic yet.

[dancing_serpent]

Yeah, me too. I've only just dipped my foot in the water, keep getting distracted with re-watching the drama again. Or with the animated series, just finished the first season of that one, too.

But that's totally something I want to read fic for! And I guess I need to get myself an icon, too. *g*

[schneefink]

I've started rewatching The Untamed but I'm wary of watching the animated series, I'm worried I'll get them mixed up in my head. Maybe after the rewatch.

Ooh, yes, the show would make for very pretty icons :)

[dancing_serpent]

Yeah, you may be on to something there. The music and the animation are very good, and the plot develops a lot faster than in the live action drama, but some of the differences are not to my liking. Especially regarding the characters. We see so much less of Wen Qing (only one scene with her) and Jiang YanLi (especially her, she's practically just a pretty face that sometimes shows up in the background), for example.

[schneefink]

I heard that both of their roles were increased a lot in the drama. And I can see how Jiang Yanli could play a less important role - I get very annoyed by her lack of personality (apart from "care-taker") whenever I think about it, though it is very good that it's at least shown how important she is to her brothers - but Wen Qing?! She was great, and I think I would miss her a lot.

[dancing_serpent]

Care-taker, confidante, peacekeeper - it wasn't a very forceful personality, but I wouldn't call it lacking, I guess? And she managed to stand up for her family against outsiders, too.

Of course, then she basically committed suicide by walking unarmed into a battlefield. Which, another difference from the anime, where she never went to Cloud Recesses for training and didn't carry a sword at all.

In the animation we get more of Madame Yu and her relationship with Jiang FengMian, she has basically more screentime than Jiang YanLi and Wen Qing together.

(Also, look, I finally got myself an icon. *g*)

[schneefink]

Pretty!

Okay, yes, she does have a personality. But there's so much that's lacking - we never see her reaction to Wei Wuxian leaving for Yiling, for example, and I don't think she ever got a scene where she was not focused on either her brothers, her husband, or her son. And making her a sword-carrying cultivator makes it even weirder that she walked into the battlefield without a sword - and iirc we didn't even see why/how she traveled to Nevernight in the first place. I am very grateful that they increased her role as much as they did, but it also makes it more obvious that she's a support for other characters' stories.

I do like Madame Yu! (As a character.) Maybe I'll have to check out the animated version eventually.

[dancing_serpent]

And another one! This show has eaten my brain, I tell you. I mean, I love Guardian, but I still haven't dared to watch the last five episodes. But I'm on my second rewatch now for The Untamed. Well, first rewatch of the flashback/past episodes, second rewatch of the present day plot.

I don't think she ever got a scene where she was not focused on either her brothers, her husband, or her son.
That's true. I tried, but I really couldn't think of even one.

I can only guess and say that grief made her not think clearly, and I'm assuming she used her sword to fly herself to Nevernight, but then she would have had it with her, right? *sigh*

They all do get to places far too fast in my opinion, it gives the impression that everything is in a few hours walking distance. In the drama we see them traveling by sword only once, and one other time it's mentioned that they are going to do that. In the animated version we get to see that a little more often.

Madame Yu is an awesome character! Her attitude and her fight scenes were very powerful, both in the live action and the animated version! And yeah, I'm going to watch the second season, too, eventually.

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I kind of got the impression that only very accomplished cultivators can travel by sword? I assumed that Yanli can't, because while she carries a sword iirc we never actually see her use it. And from Lanling to Nevernight would be quite a long time to travel by sword. But how would she have convinced the Jin sect to take her with them?
...now I want the AU where Yanli didn't go to Nevernight. I wonder how the battle would have ended...

[dancing_serpent]

Yes, that's what they told us early on. But then Wen Chao, Wen ZhuLiu and some random nameless flunkies were all flying to Burial Mounds. The first two, yeah, I totally agree on being accomplished cultivators. But again, some random nameless flunkies? Also, after YanLi leaves Cloud Recesses we don't ever see her with a sword again. Maybe we should just dismiss it as either continuation errors, plot holes, or plot convenient retcon. *g*

[schneefink]

There could still be a difference between a nameless soldier and someone like Yanli who was not trained for war; especially if you assume that to get an invite to e.g. the Cloud Recesses retreat you don't need to be a talented cultivator, it's enough if you're from a noble clan.

The fewer obvious plot holes a canon has, the more I try to make the ones I see make sense... but in this case I don't see how, so I should try not to think too hard about it ^^